Jan 7, 2008

Speculation: Does "Find 815" exist in the same "universe" as "The Lost Experience?"


I've starting to wonder whether or not Find 815 exists in the same "reality" as The LOST Experience (TLE from here on). TLE aknowledged the existance of LOST but played it out to be fiction and propaganda made by ABC.

Up until now Find 815 has not mentioned LOST, and understandably so. The show being in this game would create quite a paradox, more so than it did in TLE since the search of Oceanic 815 is so closely related to the actual canon of the show compared to TLE's search for Alvar Hanso.

I am speculationg that LOST, as a show, does not exist in Sam's universe. Therefore to Rachel Blake he is, in theory, fictional. I think Sam is part of the actual TV LOST universe, which is at least partially fictional to characters of The LOST Experience universe. I hope that all makes sense. :)

What do you think? Share your thoughts in the comments!

35 comments:

experimentalfilm! said...

this makes a lot of sense . rachel blake was revealing the truth about the hanso foundation, and hanso was angry that Lost was showing them in a negative light, more or less . but for sam, this is really happening . 815 is real, losties are real .. it really gives a different feeling than the old ARG . i like it better .. i like to think that lost is "real", and this really plays into that .

Bolivar Baez (2006-5715) said...

To me this ARG was more of a cinematic adventure, rather than the more realistic approach of the TLE.

blandestk said...

i agree with the premise.

i still have questions about why naomi says the "plane" was found. either she was blatantly lying or only certain people knew about the found "plane." in sam's world, it seems the plane has definitely not been located.

Love-Over said...

what about sam's manifest.... just tell me how did he get our losties names

Chris said...

I think Find815 exists in the "LOST" world, while TLE exists in "our" world.

Congested said...

blandestk said... i still have questions about why naomi says the "plane" was found.

Me too. I think the report about the plane being found that Anthony Cooper and Naomi mention may play into this. Maybe Sam helps discover the "wreckage" that Naomi mentions. :/

love-over said...
what about sam's manifest.... just tell me how did he get our losties names


That is odd to me too. My only guess is that they wanted recognizable people to be on the manifest and since they don't have a name for each crash survivor (or non-survivor) in the show they wanted to limit the in-game manifest to keep it recognizable for people who lightly follow the show. That's just a guess on my part tho.

Love-Over said...

Damon Lindelof:
"I would say in terms of all the… background that we did, in terms of the Valenzetti equation and explaining the formation of the Hanso Foundation and doing the other films…we’d consider that stuff canon to the show... "
"..But we can say that all the factoids that she was uncovering were vetted, in fact many of them were written by us personally so they are canon..."

http://www.lostpedia.com/wiki/The_Lost_Experience#Remaining_questions

miniruffles said...

When Namoi mentions the deep ocean trench off the coast of Bali, that is the Sunda Trench.

This must be taking place in the LOST universe before the outside world finds the fake wreckage. Sam is going to find it.It's all faked....the real question is..by who, and how?

It can't be 2006. Sam says in the hack "on the 22nd of september, oceanic...." he dosent mention the year. making it seem like this just happened months ago.

Blake said...

"It can't be 2006. Sam says in the hack "on the 22nd of september, oceanic...." he dosent mention the year. making it seem like this just happened months ago."

I agree; this feels like only months after the crash. I'm wondering if it's taking place around the same time as the current Island story - Dec 2004.

I didn't follow TLE, but what you said, Congested, makes sense to me. TLE would be the "top-level" fictional world, and the Lost/Find815 world would be "meta-fictional" world within the TLE world.

I guess from the perspective of TLE, that would make Exposé a meta-meta-fictional world! ;)

blandestk said...

but what about the oceanic release about starting flights again? this is all supposed to be in 2004/2005? a few months off doesn't seem to me to warrant the hoopla that surrounds all of this.

also, if he discovers the plane and then debunks it, that leaves precious little time to publicize the event, especially if the game is to end two hours before the premier.

further, even if this is on Lost time (i.e. 2004/2005), Naomi would have already crashed on the island knowing about the "plane." so again, either she knows about a conspiracy and is a part of it or they "found" the plane beforehand and no one knows it's not true, which again would seem to contradict sam doing this research at this point in the lost timeline.

Bolivar Baez (2006-5715) said...

We have to set a timeline here...If the plane crashed in september 2004 and naomi got to the island months laters, with the knowledge of the wreckage being found, then somehow this ties in with the island "lost time".

blandestk said...

unless naomi intentionally lied.

the oceanic press release about flights resuming is dated december 28, 2007. sam reacted to this news. so either sam and the public at large were never alerted that the "plane" was discovered in 2004 or naomi is part of a conspiracy.

Manuel said...

In the oceanic press release pdf file that you can download from the http://www.flyoceanicair.com/ ewb site, it clearly appears "December 28, 2007".
Is it a plot mistake?

Jake Chambers said...

@blandestk: You forgot Cooper. If he was in on it with Naomi, it'd get just too complicated...

As for which ARG is in which reality, I thought it was clear all the time - TLE is in "our", find815 in the show's reality...

Blake said...

Good call on the press release date; I had forgot about that.

But it seems wrong. It doesn't seem like a plane crash investigation would last over three years during which Oceanic would not have been flying, and family members would still be holding out hope for survivors. If you go back to Sam's hacked video on the Oceanic site, he talks about it as if it was recent - he says "on the 22nd of September...", no mention of year. The first anonymous email mentioned "the recent tragedy". None of these things jive with a three-year-after-the-crash timeline. I suspect they have some messed up time issues going on here.

Rafaella Albuquerque said...

For sure they have some messed up time line! First they put NASDAQ info from 2006.. than they put the text about the 2004 and 2005 earthquakes at the Sunda trech Page.. than they take of those informations.. I keep thinking that they made a mistake by release those information and now we are all confuse about this facts!

SpOOky said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
blandestk said...

See, even if Sam is in 2004/2005 time, the fact that Cooper knew about the plane as well just doesn't make sense. If someone like Cooper could know, than surely Sam would know...

I find it hard to believe that something as big as the press release would have a date as glaringly incorrect. I think Sam has to be current time.

Joshjb said...

Maybe they thought found the wreckage in 2004 like Naomi said, but someone kept digging and it turned out that wasn't flight 815, so they announced that it in fact wasn't found, and they don't know if there are any survivors, etc... So now after a few years they haven't found anything, and Sam is getting impatient. He decides to take matters into his own hands.

I hope they somehow get the Losties in this... like he either gets to the island and brings some people home, or he can't find anything, and then some survivors come home.

Anyway, we'll see.

Killerbob said...

Cooper only said that his son is dead in a plane crash, probably because Oceanic abandoned the research and declared the losties dead.
Cooper never said that oceanic 815 has been discovered.

I think that Naomi lied to the losties to manipulate them.

Paula said...

again, my 2 cents....
i DO believe is on the Losties time...
He hasn't found the oceanic plane in the deep water yet, but he probably will...
All the stuff that was date related was taken out of the game for a reason. I think TPTB want to keep us clueless about the the time where this game is so that we can be mesmerized when we find out that Sam is going to find the losties or something like that!
You say Sam doesn't know about the plane being found... well... we're just begining chapter 2 of the game :) be patient... ;)

Dave said...

This may have already been said before, but . . . maybe the freighter that's coming to the Island (that Jack called on Naomi's phone) is the Christiane I, and Sam is on that boat? Maybe this ARG is the freighter's backstory?

This may have also been said before, but . . . perhaps the "Anthony Cooper" that Sawyer "killed" was an apparition of the smoke monster. If so, his story and Naomi's story wouldn't have to line up. They could both be lying.

Yeah, after reading all that, it sounds pretty far-fetched.

Tevildo said...

The press release date was acknowledged as a mistake, and most of the stuff in the game that would nail down a timeframe (tsunami-related dates on maps, the stock ticker) has been changed. Like the Maxwell compass issues, I think we can chalk the date nebularity to a series of unintentional goofups. It's late 2004.

Edward said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Edward said...

What happens if this guy is living at the same time of Jack and Kate's flashback?

It would make sense that while Oceanic is ready to declare them all dead (and cleaned the island) , the oceanic 6 are keep shut.

This could mean that Ben in some way could cross his way with Jack trying to go back to the island.

Of course, this theory is not serious and ignoring that Naomi said they find all of the bodies and wreckage. But still it would be funny for these to happen, specially seeing long-bearded jack in Christine I or Jakarta. At least a second.

What do you think?

Edward said...

Sam, not ben

Cyborg771 said...

It's obvious that the creators of this game underestimated it's players. They didn't expect us to notice these things. I am really starting to think that this game wasn't made for the people that enjoyed the first game, but for the people who never got a chance to participate. So far, every major clue in this game has been solvable by a 10 year old. The hardest thing we've had to do is find a URL hidden in some gibberish. TLE was way more convoluted, and I think, way more fun than this. I hope they step it up in chapter 2.

Beccy said...

Sorry if someone's said this, but Sam's universe definitely exists in the same universe as Lost, because in Sam's notebook he has profiles on some of the lostaways (http://www.find815.com/site/index.php#Scene_1)
...Whether that means that he is in the same "universe" as TLE which acknowledged Lost is not clear...I think I've actually confused myself...

Tevildo said...

I believe Cyborg771 is correct, especially given how many "clues" have turned out to be vanity-inserts from the game creators. We know more about them than we do about Sam!

Joshjb said...

I agree with cyborg that the game is way too easy. I was hoping it'd be a bit more complicated, and have us searching until we get the next piece of info.
All we're doing is checking the site when it's updated, when we get something new, it takes about 10 minutes to complete, and then we have to wait another 48 hours for something new while we basically have nothing to search for, and theorize about... so far what we've been taking as clues seem to be things that are not important to the game.

Hopefully things will start to speed up later.

P.S. I'm still excited for the game... it's better than nothing! :)

Jake Chambers said...

@Killerbob:
No, Cooper said EXACTLY that the plane was found:
SAWYER: And he's dead cause you threw him out a window?

COOPER: No he survived that. But it paralysed him, permanently. He's dead because the plane he was flying on crashed in the Pacific.

SAWYER: Well I got bad news for ya pops, cause I was on that plane with your son. He sure as hell wasn't crippled. And we didn't crash in the Pacific, we crashed here on this Island.

COOPER: You sure its an Island?

SAWYER: Well what else is it?

COOPER: Little hot for heaven isn't it?

SAWYER: [Sarcastically] Oh OK, so we're dead?

COOPER: They found your plane on the bottom of the ocean.

As for the Christiane I being Naomi's ship... I thought so too, but now it seems kinda unlikely.

As for this game - it's obviously different in style to TLE and we should appreciate it as such.

mantooth12 said...

Isnt it possible that oceanic posed the finding of 815? They could have put an old or unused plane they didnt care about in the ocean where people might have looked. They would do this because the oceanic doesnt want to look bad.. people will know them as the company with a "lost" or "disappearing" plane. It would be better for them to "find" the plane and blame the reason on something more realistic, like a hijaker or engine failure.
And i once saw online ( i dont know if it was for find 815 or not) a video of a newscast saying they "found" the plane and the people in the plane, but they would not release footage of the dead people because "they didnt have the families permission to"
It's a lie.. all of it... I dont think anyone should trust oceanic airlines.

Blake said...

Tevildo said...

The press release date was acknowledged as a mistake...


Was it? Interesting. Do you happen to have a link to that? (I'm not doubting, I'm just interested)

Regarding Cooper's and Naomi's comments about the found plane crash... what if Sam's investigations leads to the discovery a (faked) 815 plane crash. Perhaps Find 815 is taking place prior to when Naomi first mentioned the discovery of the plane to the survivors (Dec 18, 2004).

It wouldn't be hard for me to believe that all these date inconsistencies in the game (stocks, press release, map pins) were mistakes by the people making the game, as opposed to the creators who would be more keyed in to the canonical timeline.

Tevildo said...

Actually no... and I'm usually such a stickler for references. My apologies. Can anyone else help here?

frisbee5 said...

Re. "And i once saw online ( i dont know if it was for find 815 or not) a video of a newscast saying they "found" the plane and the people in the plane, but they would not release footage of the dead people because "they didnt have the families permission to"


THis was on Youtube but was an admitted fan creation and has no real connection to LOST